(Msg. 1) Posted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 12:07 pm
Post subject: Creative spell use Archived from groups: rec>games>frp>dnd (more info?)
What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
for spells?
I'm specifically thinking along the lines of verbs for the "command"
spell or illusions through the various "image" line of spells, but as
creative players have shown time and again, they can often think
outside of the box and apply more rigid ones in odd situations as
well.
I'm trying to think of a specific recent case in my group, but it
seems they haven't been very inspiring of late - all I can remember
right now is a character commanding an orc to "catch" as the party
hurled a large boulder its way.
(Msg. 2) Posted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Fri, 7 Aug 2009 12:07:29 -0700 (PDT), BakaMatt
wrote:
>What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
>for spells?
>
>I'm specifically thinking along the lines of verbs for the "command"
>spell or illusions through the various "image" line of spells, but as
>creative players have shown time and again, they can often think
>outside of the box and apply more rigid ones in odd situations as
>well.
>
>I'm trying to think of a specific recent case in my group, but it
>seems they haven't been very inspiring of late - all I can remember
>right now is a character commanding an orc to "catch" as the party
>hurled a large boulder its way.
Well, in 3.5 the wording in COMMAND limits your verb options to just
the ones they give in the spell description. It says "You may select
from the following options. <List>" But back in 1E (when you weren't
so limited), playing in a game that included Called Shots (much harder
to hit, but a lot more damage if you made it), a nice COMMAND was
"Undress". Because if you have watched people in the SCA coming off
the list field (or any other group that actually fights in armor),
almost every time the very FIRST thing they do is drop what's in their
hands and take off their helmet. So with one person using the COMMAND
"Undress" and another one (or more) waiting with "Called Shot to the
Head" (now unarmored, AC 10), one could do a LOT of damage.
I don't recall the exact details now, but a called shot to the head
was something along the lines of a -8 penalty to hit while the damage
you did was multiplied x4 if you DID hit. But if the fighter in full
plate drops his weapon and shield and takes off his helmet, you just
got that entire "to hit" penalty back. His head just got 8 places
less armored. So for a first level spell you did the equivalent of
triple the damage your teammate would do (your friend swinging the
weapon gets credit for what he would have done without the spell, you
get credit for the increase.)
(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:25 am
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
Alien mind control rays made BakaMatt write:
> I'm specifically thinking along the lines of verbs for the "command"
> spell
the least interesting use of command in my campaigns was a gladiator
duel, in which the cleric of loki PC was faced with another cleric of
equal level. initiative was rolled, and both clerics went
simultaneously. i faced the player, and he faced me, and we shouted
in perfect unison, 'surrender!'
clerics were banned from the arena afterward.
--
.--._.--.
|_/---\_| drow DeleteThis @bin.sh (CARRIER LOST) <http://www.bin.sh/>
] |<3 | [ -----------------------------------------------------------------
|~\---/~| Please proceed to the chamberlock. Mind the gap.
`--'~'--'
(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 12:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Fri, 7 Aug 2009 12:07:29 -0700 (PDT), BakaMatt
wrote:
>What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
>for spells?
>
>I'm specifically thinking along the lines of verbs for the "command"
>spell or illusions through the various "image" line of spells, but as
>creative players have shown time and again, they can often think
>outside of the box and apply more rigid ones in odd situations as
>well.
>
>I'm trying to think of a specific recent case in my group, but it
>seems they haven't been very inspiring of late - all I can remember
>right now is a character commanding an orc to "catch" as the party
>hurled a large boulder its way.
One I got away with but shouldn't have:
We were in a city, there was a bad guy on a bridge with a fairly low
railing. I commanded him to "vault". At first the DM's reaction was
"huh?", then I said "As in pole vault".
Only later did I recall it also describes a large safe.
(Msg. 5) Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 12:54 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 18:18:20 -0700 (PDT), Yiddishwriter
wrote:
>I've used the Command spell in "legitimate" ways that were very
>effective.
>
>In a 2E game, I was being attacked in my motel room. A wizard has
>used Spider Climb and was clinging to the outside of the building
>under my window. I cast Command. "Fall" and down he went. It was
>beautiful.
Fails--how is he going to be a season?
>In a 3E game I swam a river (with the help of Water Breathing) to
>commandeer a raft. Other party members were either also swimming or
>attacking those on the raft from the river bed. When I reached the
>raft there were two bad guys left. I casted Command on one of them.
>"Flee" and off the raft he went to drown in the river. The other guy
>immediately surrendered. It was beautiful.
(Msg. 6) Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 1:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
BakaMatt wrote:
> What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
> for spells?
Not very, I suppose. Warp Wood to enlarge a tiny fairie gate (so,
you're all entering the warped gate?), Reverse Gravity as an ejector
seat, Cone of Cold as a bridge, Lightning Bolt to blind, Fireball for a
smokescreen. Fireball's like a sonic screwdriver, solves every problem
somehow or another. Chain reacting some alchemical stuff.
There's abstract counters and triggers as house rules, but that's not
useful in general.
> I'm specifically thinking along the lines of verbs for the "command"
> spell or illusions through the various "image" line of spells, but as
> creative players have shown time and again, they can often think outside
> of the box and apply more rigid ones in odd situations as well.
Just remember you can see through your own illusions, so they make
great hiding spots. Command is kinda weird, I let it apply a condition
for a round; stunned, panicked, sickened, prone, or whatever.
> I'm trying to think of a specific recent case in my group, but it seems
> they haven't been very inspiring of late - all I can remember right now
> is a character commanding an orc to "catch" as the party hurled a large
> boulder its way.
"Suicide" isn't really supposed to work, but that is cute. 8]
--
tussock
The different ways one can approach D&D is what makes it D&D.
(Msg. 7) Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 1:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 16:32:04 +0000 (UTC), tussock
wrote:
>> I'm trying to think of a specific recent case in my group, but it seems
>> they haven't been very inspiring of late - all I can remember right now
>> is a character commanding an orc to "catch" as the party hurled a large
>> boulder its way.
>
> "Suicide" isn't really supposed to work, but that is cute. 8]
He was commanded to do something dangerous, he wasn't commanded to
commit suicide. I would have no problem with it.
(Msg. 8) Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 9:37 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Aug 7, 12:07 pm, BakaMatt wrote:
> What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
> for spells?
>
> I'm specifically thinking along the lines of verbs for the "command"
> spell or illusions through the various "image" line of spells, but as
> creative players have shown time and again, they can often think
> outside of the box and apply more rigid ones in odd situations as
> well.
>
> I'm trying to think of a specific recent case in my group, but it
> seems they haven't been very inspiring of late - all I can remember
> right now is a character commanding an orc to "catch" as the party
> hurled a large boulder its way.
The one that sticks with me, is not really something terribly useful,
but it was 2nd ed, the spell 'Everburning Log' as cast upon a vampire
lighting him on fire.
(Msg. 9) Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 10:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 18:06:57 -0700 (PDT), Yiddishwriter
wrote:
>On Aug 9, 3:54=A0pm, Loren Pechtel
>wrote:
>> On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 18:18:20 -0700 (PDT), Yiddishwriter
>>
>> wrote:
>> >I've used the Command spell in "legitimate" ways that were very
>> >effective.
>>
>> >In a 2E game, I was being attacked in my motel room. =A0A wizard has
>> >used Spider Climb and was clinging to the outside of the building
>> >under my window. =A0I cast Command. "Fall" and down he went. =A0It was
>> >beautiful.
>> Fails--how is he going to be a season?
>It's a verb. Don't be stupid.
>Gerald Katz
It's worth noting that "Fall" is given as an example of a typical
COMMAND in both the 1E and 2E PH.
What Loren refers to, I think, is that there was some discussion a
long time ago about the "must be clear and unequivocal" potion of the
spell description on words that had more than one meaning (like "Fall"
as either verb or noun). I thought it MIGHT have been in the 1E DMG,
but it's not in the section where they expand on spell descriptions.
Hmmm... maybe in the 2E Clerics Handbook? Or maybe the discussion was
in Dragon (perhaps in "Sage Advice"?)
Anyway - MOST of the "typical" words used in COMMAND contain noun
meanings.
Die - the things we roll, or as in "tool & die"
Back - the thing between your shoulderblades
Flee - just by listening, can't be told apart from "flea"
Stop - the things on an organ that change the sound ("pull out all the
stops" to make things very loud, etc.)
Fall - the season
Go - a game where you put down counters on a board to capture
territory
So while there were those who argued that "any word with both a noun
meaning and a verb meaning cannot be successfully used with COMMAND",
in practice the large majority of players went with the pretty clear
intent that the context would make it obvious enough that the verb
meaning was intended.
(Msg. 10) Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 7:34 am
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 18:06:57 -0700 (PDT), Yiddishwriter
wrote:
>On Aug 9, 3:54 pm, Loren Pechtel
>wrote:
>> On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 18:18:20 -0700 (PDT), Yiddishwriter
>>
>> wrote:
>> >I've used the Command spell in "legitimate" ways that were very
>> >effective.
>>
>> >In a 2E game, I was being attacked in my motel room. A wizard has
>> >used Spider Climb and was clinging to the outside of the building
>> >under my window. I cast Command. "Fall" and down he went. It was
>> >beautiful.
>>
>> Fails--how is he going to be a season?
>>
>
>It's a verb. Don't be stupid.
But if it can be interpreted as something other than a verb it is.
(Msg. 11) Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 7:34 am
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 02:15:30 GMT, quester RemoveThis @infionline.net (Harold
Groot) wrote:
>On Sun, 9 Aug 2009 18:06:57 -0700 (PDT), Yiddishwriter
> wrote:
>
>>On Aug 9, 3:54=A0pm, Loren Pechtel
>>wrote:
>>> On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 18:18:20 -0700 (PDT), Yiddishwriter
>>>
>>> wrote:
>>> >I've used the Command spell in "legitimate" ways that were very
>>> >effective.
>>>
>>> >In a 2E game, I was being attacked in my motel room. =A0A wizard has
>>> >used Spider Climb and was clinging to the outside of the building
>>> >under my window. =A0I cast Command. "Fall" and down he went. =A0It was
>>> >beautiful.
>
>>> Fails--how is he going to be a season?
>
>>It's a verb. Don't be stupid.
>>Gerald Katz
>
>
>It's worth noting that "Fall" is given as an example of a typical
>COMMAND in both the 1E and 2E PH.
>
>What Loren refers to, I think, is that there was some discussion a
>long time ago about the "must be clear and unequivocal" potion of the
>spell description on words that had more than one meaning (like "Fall"
>as either verb or noun). I thought it MIGHT have been in the 1E DMG,
>but it's not in the section where they expand on spell descriptions.
>Hmmm... maybe in the 2E Clerics Handbook? Or maybe the discussion was
>in Dragon (perhaps in "Sage Advice"?)
>
>Anyway - MOST of the "typical" words used in COMMAND contain noun
>meanings.
>
>Die - the things we roll, or as in "tool & die"
>Back - the thing between your shoulderblades
>Flee - just by listening, can't be told apart from "flea"
>Stop - the things on an organ that change the sound ("pull out all the
>stops" to make things very loud, etc.)
>Fall - the season
>Go - a game where you put down counters on a board to capture
>territory
>
>So while there were those who argued that "any word with both a noun
>meaning and a verb meaning cannot be successfully used with COMMAND",
>in practice the large majority of players went with the pretty clear
>intent that the context would make it obvious enough that the verb
>meaning was intended.
>
It's a poorly designed spell.
(Msg. 12) Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 1:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
Keith Davies wrote:
> tussock wrote:
>>
>> Command is kinda weird, I let it apply a condition for a round;
>> stunned, panicked, sickened, prone, or whatever.
>
> *yoink*. That's very good.
It's easy, fits the original intent of the spell, and there's always
a condition chart lying around somewhere. Every little thing I don't have
to look up is a bonus.
> A number of conditions have grades -- fear has two or three steps, as I
> recall. Do you get to pick a specific one, or is it fixed by the spell?
I normally use the worst available, as appropriate to the command and
limited by what's possible for the target. Blind rather than dazzled,
stunned rather than slowed, panicked rather than frightened or shaken.
It's already fairly limited by duration.
I mean, "fall" puts the target prone, that's +4 to be attacked, -4 to
hit, can't move, and suffers an AoO to recover even with just the 1 round
duration. Panicked for one round isn't any worse, though stunned would be
by core rules (better as a 1 or 2-teir gap).
> I can see it being based on the save (a higher-level form may have 'Will
> save partial'; fail your save and get hit with the second or third step
> on the condition, succeed and get a lesser effect), relative level
> (every five[1] levels you have more than the HD of the target, the
> greater the effect on successful casting).
Perhaps multiple effects, stacked as appropriate. Stunned and prone,
panicked and deaf. I should think more on critical failures for saves,
interesting potential for mayhem.
> The more I think about it, the more I like it. Though that may be the
> mead talking, I may let you know tomorrow if I change my mind.
I little beer makes the beer taste good, or so they tell me.
--
tussock
The different ways one can approach D&D is what makes it D&D.
(Msg. 13) Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 1:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
Loren Pechtel wrote:
>> What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
>> for spells?
>>
>> I'm specifically thinking along the lines of verbs for the "command"
>> spell or illusions through the various "image" line of spells, but as
>> creative players have shown time and again, they can often think
>> outside of the box and apply more rigid ones in odd situations as
>> well.
>>
>> I'm trying to think of a specific recent case in my group, but it
>> seems they haven't been very inspiring of late - all I can remember
>> right now is a character commanding an orc to "catch" as the party
>> hurled a large boulder its way.
>
> One I got away with but shouldn't have:
>
> We were in a city, there was a bad guy on a bridge with a fairly low
> railing. I commanded him to "vault". At first the DM's reaction was
> "huh?", then I said "As in pole vault".
>
> Only later did I recall it also describes a large safe.
Another one that probably shouldn't have worked, but it was fun anyway:
strategically placing explosive runes scrolls and remotely triggering
them using a spyglass.
(Msg. 14) Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 4:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
BakaMatt wrote:
> What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
> for spells?
Extended shrink cast on very large boulders (extended so that they can be
effectively stored for a long time). Fly to gain height. Drop. Say
command word to end shrink effect. Big crush. Annoying as all hell.
(Msg. 15) Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 7:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Creative spell use [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
On Fri, 14 Aug 2009 16:25:18 -0600, Darin McBride
wrote:
>BakaMatt wrote:
>
>> What are some of the most creative uses your players have come up with
>> for spells?
>
>Extended shrink cast on very large boulders (extended so that they can be
>effectively stored for a long time). Fly to gain height. Drop. Say
>command word to end shrink effect. Big crush. Annoying as all hell.
You can shrink appropriate sized boulders down to the size of sling
bullets, then set up an WALL OF DISPEL MAGIC (it's automatic against
your own magic). Slinging these "bullets" through the WODM becomes
the equivalent of having a small siege engine with very well-aimed
missiles. Or, with an appropriate illusion to back it up, it can be
VERY convincing that you've got a bunch of giants on your side
throwing boulders.
(=I= like doing such things - but the question was about the creative
uses for spells my =players= have come up with, not what =I've= come
up with.)
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